65: Visualizing Success Affects Your Way Of Doing Business with Logan Christopher
Seeing a future where there is only success for the business and the clients is a big image for our minds to filter. But with this mental conditioning, entrepreneurs can see the future the way they are programming the outcome so that the mind can represent it as something being done in actual reality. And with this belief of visualizing success, Logan Christopher of Lost Empire Herbs believes that entrepreneurs can bring clients to their doors. Learn more of Logan’s mental conditioning and how this visualization method became a big part of his life and his business.
Visualizing Success Affects Your Way Of Doing Business with Logan Christopher
My guest is a business expert who runs what I would call an unconventional company. He sells herbs. I know what some of you are thinking. No, he’s not a drug dealer. He has systematically tested individual and highly-concentrated herbs and herbal mixtures on himself, and probably a lot of his friends as well. Over the last ten years, he’s built a powerhouse, seven-figure company focused on solving problems for his clients. Logan Christopher, welcome to the show.
Thanks for having me, Mitch. I’m excited to be here.
I’m so glad you are. I love your website. It’s like of a bit of an encyclopedia. I actually got lost on LostEmpireHerbs.com as I just paged through so many of the different things that you offer. Clearly, this has evolved over time. You’ve been doing this for ten years. Let’s go back to the beginning. Tell us the story of how you started the company and why you started the company.
Before Lost Empire Herbs came to be that was only about five years ago, my first business, and the business is still running to this day, is Legendary Strength. I really got interested in fitness and strength training. I wasn’t naturally strong or athletic. I was the proverbial 98-pound weakling entering high school. I played football but I was never really good at it. It was right after high school I learned about body weight exercises and what you could do beyond push-ups and squats and sit-ups and those things. I started to actually see some success with that. From there, that led to kettlebells and then that led to Old Time Strongman Training, which I can certainly talk more about. I just really got involved in these things and wanted to become great at doing them so that’s what I set out to do. I was also looking for a career at the time so I became a personal trainer. Then that transitioned to an online business there.
I can see how that transition would happen. I think there is a primary reason you wanted to get strong as a 98-pound weakling. What was it? Why don’t you tell us what that really was?
I went through a dark period in high school where I had no friends and didn’t really like myself and all this. With strength training, what I found once I started to go this unconventional route and started to see results with it, I was building up my body and at the same time I was building up my confidence. With fitness, that was the first thing where I realized I had self-control. I could change something about myself that I could begin to become strong and achieve these skills that I was not able to do, whereas I didn’t really have that before. For me, it was the foundational piece that allowed me to build my confidence, which then was very important for going into business for myself.
Let’s be honest, the real reason you did it was to pick up girls. I know that’s a part of it. After all, let’s just call a spade a spade here. The fact is that you’re a 98-pound weakling. Compared to the guys on the football team, you weren’t much to look at. You figured out a way to do that. My way was different than yours, Logan. I actually built a rock band in high school. We had same objective but different paths to get there. Obviously, yours is the healthier.
I had no musical skill myself. I never played an instrument. I’m starting to play the piano now, having a lot of fun with it. At the time, I had no skills. I became friends with guys who were in the rock band and I roadied for them. It certainly had some aspects of going into that field.
The roadies usually get the outliers, which is better than nothing, right?
Yeah. It was fun times.
LegendaryStrength.com came out of your own interest in transforming yourself. I want to spend a minute on this transformation part and transforming one’s self. Every one of us has a mental image picture of who we are and what we even look like in our heads. We can change that, can’t we, Logan?
Absolutely. For me as I got into this, it was something where I realized that I could set a goal in achieving, go out there and change things about myself. That mental component, that visualization component was really important. That actually became one of my strong suits, something that I went into a lot more detail in because I wasn’t naturally stronger athletic. I was always on the lookout for a secret weapon. That led me to mental training and various things I did with that. That also led me into the herbs in the first place.
Let’s go back to the mental training part. Listeners, as you hear Logan tell his story, it would be a good idea to think about one of the things that you could challenge yourself to do either with your own body, with your diet or maybe in your business. Logan, what would you tell listeners who want to know a little bit more about the mindset element of this? What could they do?
Everything that we are capable of doing comes down to what we believe we’re capable of doing. There’s much more to it than that, but that’s the foundational piece. If we believe that we can lift a weight or we believe we can start a business regardless of what it actually is, if that belief is there, then we’re going to be able to do that. Whereas if that belief is not there, we’re not going to be able to do it or not have the same chance of success at doing something. There’s a whole bunch of ways you can work with beliefs, but it comes down to experience. You can mentally construct this experience and there are different ways of doing that. If you can just set out and get a small win with what you’re doing, then that’s going to set the foundational stone and then you just keep building up from there. The more you can believe in yourself in whatever you’re trying to do, the better results you’ll get.
If I have a person in front of me and I’m talking to this individual and say she wants something but doesn’t believe that she could get it. Help me bridge the gap right now between wants and belief and then acquiring.
Let me tell a story. This is one of my favorite stories because it had such a good result. This was working with a woman in strength training and she was already a pretty strong woman. She was able to do two one-arm push-ups, but she had a mental block about being able to do any more than this. What I did was just had her step behind the curtain in her own mind to look how did she internally perceive this exercise. I can go into a lot of detail on this, there’s a whole bunch that goes really with this but basically she had these mental images and feelings with it that didn’t show that she had confidence. It was like a dim, dark picture.
What we did was we looked at different exercise that was much easier for her to do and we solved the internal qualities of that. It was a bigger, brighter image that actually had a yellow tinge to it. For whatever reason, her neurology internally coded these exercises this way so when we took those things from the easy exercise to the one-arm push-up, the hard exercise and just had her run through that a couple of times, basically making a bigger, brighter image, better feelings, stronger connection throughout the body, then she went and did the one-arm push-up and she was able to do seven reps in it. She went from two to seven, which is a pretty dramatic increase.
This goes back to the 1960s to a word I haven’t heard in a long time called pre-visualization. What I remember that word meaning is doing a lot of what you’re talking about now. The thing that you had which is so important is the lightness or dimness of the way the memory appears to you in your head. Tell me why you do that.
A lot of people have heard of visualization and probably many people listening to this have practiced it whether in athletics or anything else. Most of the time when people are doing it, they’re just going by default. They’re imagining things and hopefully you’re bringing in your different senses so you’re not just seeing it, but you’re hearing the sounds going on and you’re feeling it in your body, even smell and taste. Most people are going to try to make this as realistic as possible. What I found from my training in neuro-linguistic programming was that the qualities of these different sensory details really drive what that visualization is going to do for you. You can make it realistic and that’s good. The mind’s going to represent that as if it’s actually going through. If we do something like brighten up the image, in essence that’s increasing the intensity of it. With something like a strength exercise, if you increase the intensity of it, you’ll generally feel more intensity of your own strength. That’s something I’ve done in fitness, but this does apply to other things that you’re doing. If you’re visualizing for bringing those clients in the door, you can use the same thing. Have a brighter imagery come up or other factors like that greater sound, different things that will help you make you feel it more in your body. That’s going to strengthen that belief.
There’s another very important element of what you’re talking about here. The mind has a filter and it’s called the bullshit filter. If we try to lie to ourselves, the mind’s going to yell, “Bullshit.” What you’re doing, by changing the intensity of the image and the brightness of the image, is you’re bypassing that filter and you’re allowing the mind to accept an image of the future, brighter and more vivid than it would have been before. I think that’s brilliant. I think that’s a huge differentiator from the way I had been taught and the way I’d done it in the past. I’d love for you to share more about that.
I’ll give another example. I went out and did a strongman training. This is the strongman stuff that you’ll typically see on ESPN. It’s generally a big men sport. I’m not really a big guy. I’m 6’2″ and I weigh about 200 pounds, which is more than I normally weigh. I actually cut down weight down to 175 pounds for this event. I was doing the strength training, working on the exercises to prepare for it. You definitely have to have that physical preparation. Every single morning, I would visualize myself going through the events. The key thing that I did was I went to the end after the strongman competition was over and I heard them announcing who was the winner. It was me. I heard the roar of the crowd. I saw myself going up there getting the trophy and all that. I did this over and over again, programming my future. I did those elements like associating to the picture, having the brightness, all these different things. I did that over and over, and I won the competition. When they’re actually announcing the winner, I had the strangest sense of déjà vu because I had lived through that moment probably 50 different times before. It was a little different than my visualization because I didn’t know all these details, but I still had that strange sense. I feel if you are programming for a specific instance in the future like this, that sense of déjà vu, if you get that, that means you’ve done it right.
Another thing that I heard you say is that you didn’t do it once or twice. You did it 50 times. Clearly, what we’re doing here is mental conditioning. You’re conditioning your own mind to see the future the way you are programming the outcome. This actually applies to just about every element of life. I could do this if I wanted to, for example, lose weight or I wanted to stop eating ice cream and pizza every day for lunch and dinner. It seems like you can apply this to just about anything.
I definitely use it in business as well, seeing the customers come in and all that. Once again, you’ve got to do the physical actions. This isn’t what some people take like the secret, the law of attraction, “I’m just going to think about it and everything’s going to come to me.” I don’t quite believe in that. I feel if you back up the physical actions with the mental programming, then you get synergistic results, one plus one equals ten.
I like the way you put it. It makes sense. It’s simple. Anybody can do it. I urge you to do it if you’re listening to Logan describe this process. I’ve met you, we’ve been at an event together and we had a lot of fun. I know you’re a strong guy, but I also know you’re a smart guy. I want you to tell me what went through your mind as you were starting to transition into the herb business. Where were you before, what flipped you in that direction and how did you take it forward?
I was working in the Legendary Strength business. I wasn’t naturally strong or athletic so I was always looking for the edge that led me into all that mental training stuff. I also got interested in health and nutrition. I’m a kid of my generation. I grew up on Hot Pockets and never ate fruits or vegetables or anything. As I started in strength I realized, “If you get healthier that’s going to help with recovery, you’re not going to get sick,” all these things, so I started doing that. That in turn led me to herbalism, specifically in the first place it was Chinese tonic herbalism. They have this idea in there of radiant health, and what this means is health beyond danger. For many people in the West, they feel like health is the absence of disease. We don’t really have a firm idea of what it is to really be healthy because that’s an aspect of it, but that’s not the whole picture. This idea of radiant health really grabbed me. You can become so healthy that you’re not in danger of even getting sick in the first place. A lot of the best herbs in the world are from Chinese medicine. These things are going to support your health. We also in the West have this idea. You take in herb in order to fix some condition that you have. That’s how our whole drug model works. If you take some of these tonic herbs, some of these superior herbs, these are things that support your health in growing and just getting better overall and herbs that you can be on long-term. You’re not taking them for a specific disease. You’re just taking them to be healthier in the first place.
I think what you’re describing is the exact difference between Eastern and Western medicine. As you know, Eastern medicine truly focuses on increasing the strength of the immune system, just making people healthier. Whatever disease or issues they have, I won’t say everything, but many of them will dissipate and resolve on their own. Is that right?
Yeah. Absolutely there are herbs that you can use to treat different things that you may have. I really like this idea of the superior herbs of things that just support everything. I was working on becoming stronger and doing these crazy feats of strength and various things that I did. One of the first herbs that I took was cordyceps mushroom. It’s a very interesting fungus that comes out of the Himalayan Mountains. It’s actually a fungus that attaches itself to a caterpillar and overtakes it, and then sprouts a fruiting body; very interesting stuff. This is pretty well-known for helping to increase endurance. Various Olympic level athletes have used it for such. I started taking this and I noticed the difference in my workouts. From that moment, I was hooked and I was like, “This is another secret weapon.” Down the line there’s a whole bunch of other herbs that work on different things. Actually one of my older brothers, I have two brothers who are partners in the herb company, he came to me and he was starting to get in the herbs himself. He said, “If I source this stuff, do you want to throw up a website and start selling it?” It began really as just a simple little experiment outside of what I was already doing. We started it there from the kitchen table, and since then it has grown quite significantly.
Anybody, go to LostEmpireHerbs.com. You’ll see Logan and his family members commenting on many of the things. I love reading the comments too. I think the comments really point to whether things are real or not. You started with this one specific cordyceps idea, the mushroom.
Actually, that was not our first herb that we sold. We do have that one now, but our first and the main herb was Pine Pollen, which most people have heard of. It’s literally the pollen in the pine trees. They have probably seen the yellow dust coating their cars if they live in certain parts of the country, but they don’t realize that this has been used for thousands of years in Chinese medicine. It’s a really strong herb that can do lots of amazing things for the human body, especially for men. What’s pretty unique about Pine Pollen is that it has human hormones in it. It actually has testosterone, DHA, other hormones of this nature, really small trace amounts so it’s nothing like steroids. The way I look at natural herbs as opposed to pharmaceutical drugs where you have a single isolated component, natural herbs are made by nature so all these different co-factors are around. They basically can work with your body intelligently. Something like Pine Pollen can go in there and help support your hormones intelligently.
Pine Pollen was your first secret weapon. With all the secret weapons you’ve collected enough on LostEmpireHerbs.com, the focus that I could tell seems to be strength, endurance, health. Are there any other focuses that you try to stick to when you think about bringing a new product on to the site?
Yeah. Because of what I do and also my brothers are athletic as well; my middle brother has ran barefoot marathons before so little different things than what I do. We’re all interested in athletics, so a lot of our herbs were around that whether that’s supporting your endurance or the recovery. What turns out is that a lot of the things that help with these things also help older guys with many of the issues that they have. Generally as you age, testosterone is going to go down. Something like Pine Pollen can be great for hormone health of older guys and various things like sexual function as well. All the same stuff helps for that.
I’m an older guy. It would be great to increase all functions. The one thing I’d love to solve and maybe you can solve, how do I grow more hair?
Growing hair is tricky. We do have some herbs for that. Here’s a thing about herbs, nothing works for everyone. Some herbs are going to work right in for one person, but they’re going to do nothing for another person. One herb that’s more well-known for actually turning hair back to a black color once it has gone gray is He Shou Wu, which is another one of the top anti-aging herbs from Chinese medicine. It has a reputation for that. Some people have noticed that it helps to grow thicker hair as well. I’m not saying that this absolutely will work. What I’m saying is try, experiment and see what happens for you.
I think what’s cool about your company is that you’re basically curating all these different herbs, and then bringing the best to the market. Out of curiosity, where do you get this stuff?
Everything I’ve done starts from that selfish thing. I write books because I want to learn a subject better and that’s a great way to do it. With the herbs, me and my brothers wanted to have great herbs just for ourselves. We started the business just to have our own supply in the first place. We were always looking for the highest quality stuff. Every supplement company, every herb company is going to say they have the best quality things out there. That’s marketing. It’s really tough to find the highest quality stuff. We do things like independent lab testing and we have many different suppliers, so we don’t get our herbs from any single place. A lot of our Chinese herbs come from China. We have different Ayurvedic herbs that come from India. Some of our herbs are sourced in the US. We have Maca coming down from Peru. We look all across with all our different suppliers what we’re looking to find and we seek out the best thing we possibly can find. What happens sometimes is that we have something that’s really good but then we find something better, so we switch over our supply to that new thing.
You’re constantly looking for higher quality to better serve your clients. Let’s talk about the business itself. All businesses need customers and obviously the best way to get customers is word of mouth. There’s got to be a point in time when you needed to get customers because you had none. What did you do?
When we started, it was real small. I promoted it with the list I had grown from Legendary Strength. What really helped us take off was actually finding some affiliates or joint venture partners, people that basically had our customers, our clients and we’re able to send them our way. We have affiliate commission of 30% lifetime commissions right now, so that has definitely incentivized some people to send a lot of traffic our way. That was something that really helped us grow from just barely getting by to the point we’re at today.
In effect, what you’ve done is you’ve carved 30% of your entire company out and given it to others in terms of revenue. As revenue comes in the door, you had to make sure that giving that 30% away doesn’t leave the company weak and unable to go out, make a profit and buy more herbs.
That 30% is definitely built into our margins in the products and we can support that. We make sure anything that we’re getting, we have that available. We definitely would not have grown without it. We have some affiliates that make more money from the company than I do just because they’re sending us so much traffic. We basically modeled another supplement company that was doing the same thing. They had an affiliate program offering that and the lifetime commissions really appeals to some people. If you send in people today and they buy something, they get a commission for that. If that person then one year from now buys again, you’re going to get the commission once again. By really having good terms for the affiliate, some people have really grabbed on to that and sent us a lot of traffic.
That’s why affiliates go to work and build sales forces even and paying money to advertise other people’s products just to collect that commission. As you can see, with lifetime commissions, it sure makes a lot of sense. I really like how you did that. Let’s go one step further. Because the affiliate model works great, what else do you do?
We built up to a big point with that affiliate thing. We shouldn’t rely on this one source of traffic even though we have different affiliates and whatnot. We’ve really in the past couple of years started to spread ourselves out, open up more sales channels. We’ve started growing our business on Amazon, that’s one other channel, and using the advertising there and various things. Amazon used to be 1% of our business. Now, it’s about 10% and it seems to be growing at a faster pace than our website sales are, so that’s going great. We’re also opening up advertising on Google and Facebook and all the standard channels. We’ve always had a really strong content strategy. Going through our website, we have very long articles, detailed stuff, because most people when you say herbs, they’re thinking that we sell weed. There’s so much herbs out there so a lot of educational piece, which is something that gets our customers to really love us. We’re not just hawking a product, we really believe in the stuff and we’re educating and all that’s behind what we’re doing.
We met at an event and we are both members now of the same group called the Mavericks. Tell me how the Mavericks and the philosophy of creating something like an evolved enterprise has affected the way you see your business and maybe even the way you’re doing business.
When I got involved in Mavericks, that was probably about two years ago, I felt I was still a business newbie that is more of the internet lifestyle business where I write some things but there’s not a whole lot of infrastructure overhead. The margins on that business are quite great versus building this herb business. We’ve got inventory. We have an ever-growing team. It’s much more a real business than what I had with the previous business. With that, I had to learn a whole bunch of skills. Right around that time, I got involved in Mavericks. Just seeing all these different entrepreneurs in a wide variety of different businesses at different levels of success and some amazingly high levels, it really was a huge educational piece for me. My crowd before was more of the internet lifestyle business crowd. I was at events where those people were at. Learning more from real business owners and these different things opened me up in all these different ways and the new skill sets I had to learn like leading a team, systemization, all these different facets that I had only scratched the surface of before.
Just to be fair, Mavericks is great at bringing people together of all different size companies and different types of businesses. Listeners, I think if you simply decide that it’s time to join a mastermind, that it’s time to hang out with successful people. Someone very smartly said that you are the sum total of the five people that you surround yourselves with. The idea is surround yourselves with the best people you possibly can. For you and I, I believe as well as you do, that the Mavericks is a great place to do that. Yanik Silver being the leader of the Mavericks has this philosophy and it binds the group together having that philosophy. The philosophy is basically you’re not doing this just to make a profit. You’re doing this to basically benefit mankind or the world or some segment of the world. Do you see your business that way as well?
Absolutely. That’s a big aim that we’ve done and that really did become more intensified, fleshed out and clarified by being part of the Mavericks and everything that Yanik’s teaching regarding the evolved enterprise. For me, the big mission is to change the health paradigm of the world. Western medicine has some great things to it. However, it is very much broken in many ways. The way I see it is herbs always used to be a part of our diet. Herbs were used as medicine for the past hundreds of years, thousands of years, ever since humans have been around, even before that because animals use herbs as well to help treat themselves in different things. We’ve gone so far away from that. Our food has been, if not genetically modified, but hybridized and the medicine’s been taken out of it. We are lacking in these things. It’s isolated and compounded and brought up and sold in a single pill with that huge markup. I feel bringing herbs back, that’s really only the beginning of it because I’m trying to teach people and getting people back to living more in alignment with nature and seeing all the benefits that come with that. The big mission is to change how the world perceives health.
That’s what we’re all here to do. Even if you’re hustling every day to make one more sale, ultimately in your mind, and I believe this to be true of just about everybody, there is some part of us that wants to benefit others. I love the way you and the Mavericks focus on that. That’s a big part of the way I see the world too even more so now. My one question about herbs is if you take the average individual who is pretty much healthy, eating a good diet, not drinking soda and eating at McDonald’s a lot or possibly ever like many of us, where would they start with herbs? What would be the first few or individual herbs they would choose and why?
A lot of people are looking for more energy. Even if you’re healthy, many people are complaining just not having the energy to do all the different things that they want to go about in the day or maybe the mental clarity isn’t there. They just want to have more focus. This is especially true for business owners. The sharper your mind is, the more effective you’re going to be. A good one for that mental clarity, my favorite herb in this realm is Bacopa. This is an herb from Ayurvedic medicine. I can feel it right away. A lot of people can feel it right away, not everyone does. The research actually shows the best benefits come from being on it for two months, taking it every single day. Bacopa is going to really just help focus the mind in a way that’s going to give many people immediate effects and they can see the power of herbs. That’s something that we really like to focus on, herbs that people can feel, can get a tangible difference. So many people take supplements because they hear it’s good for them and they don’t really know what’s going on. We like to focus on herbs that will give people tangible effects they can feel. Only then will they actually be convinced of the power of these herbs.
What else? Is Bacopa the only one you’d recommend?
No, not at all. We have so much stuff and I invite people to look around on our website. As far as energy, there are tons of different herbs that are working on different mechanisms. We have a couple of formulas that are quite popular along these lines. The Phoenix Formula is really great. This is a combination of four herbs that has the Pine Pollen and three other herbs. It also has the He Shou Wu, the stuff we talked about for hair. It’s really good. In Chinese medicine it’s known as jing. It’s this primal essence that’s like the constitutional energy. It has implications working with the DNA. It’s really helping to restore that root. We call it Phoenix Formula because the idea is the phoenix being a mythological bird that would burn down and then be reborn from the ashes. This Phoenix Formula is going to help to do that to your health. Even people that are the average person that’s feeling pretty healthy, a lot of people will notice some benefits, some changes in their energy from doing this. A lot of people use it before workouts because it provides energy as well. That would be a good one.
Logan, this has been really a different type of an interview for me. I don’t know anybody else who does what you do.
Not many people do.
The thing about it is I like your focus on quality. I like your focus on independent testing. I like your focus really on how you build your business. Even with affiliates and the way you use the affiliates, you’ve included people. Now, you’re including more and more people as well. The one question I usually ask, the change the world question which you already answered; this is interesting because for me, it helps me really understand who I’m talking to, what their character is about. Who, in all of space and time, would you like to have one hour to enjoy a walk in the park, a quick lunch or an intense conversation with?
The first thing that comes to mind, you’re saying all space and time, so I’d like to go have a conversation with even just an average Joe from twenty years in the future or maybe an average entrepreneur. I think that would be great because this would let me know what’s coming down in the future and I could better prepare for that. As far as someone in the past, which I imagine most people typically answer the question with, for me it would be The Mighty Atom. This was a guy whose actual name was Joseph Greenstein. I’ve read his biography. That’s what really put me into the strongman realm and the health realm and herbalism he also worked with. He was a guy back in the vaudeville era, a strongman that did some unbelievable feats of strength. He was born as a small Jewish kid that should have died. The doctor said he was going to die and literally ran away and joined the circus. Through exercise and various things, he became very healthy and then very strong. Because reading his biography was a turning point in my life, I would go back and have a conversation with him.
First of all, he’s never come up before as a favorite person. That’s good. Here’s the other first on this show, no one has ever gone into the future with that question. That is awesome.
I’m a futurist, always focused on what’s coming down the pike.
If I can go with you on that trip to the future, what I’d do is I’d grab a copy of the Wall Street Journal real fast, stick it in my pocket, come home and start investing.
It would be so easy if you could have that conversation. It wouldn’t take much.
Logan, this has really been a wonderful chance that you and I have had together to be and talk and get to know each other better. I’m so glad we’re sharing it with the listeners of Your First Thousand Clients. Here’s the one last thing I want to ask you. This is all about you. What is it that you want? What is it are you looking for now? How can we help you get to your goals faster?
I would like to have more help, really allies in trying to change the world and trying to spread this message and change the health paradigm. One thing I did not mention, I watched my mother pass from breast cancer. For me that was another turning point because she did the whole standard Western medical route with chemo, radiation and surgery. In the end, it wasn’t sufficient. That was really the worst point in my life. However, I see it as the last gift that she gave me because this spurred me on much further in what I’m trying to do. Anyone that wants to ally in this mission together, I’m all ears.
How could people get a hold of you?
The best way for me is [email protected].
Logan Christopher, this has truly been a treat for me. Thank you again for appearing on the show. I can’t wait until we get to hang out again one more time.
Thanks for having me, Mitch. I had a lot of fun with it.
Resources Mentioned in This Episode:
- Logan Christopher
- Lost Empire Herbs
- Legendary Strength
- Yanik Silver
- 15% off coupon
- Radiant Health
- He Shou Wu
- Pine Pollen
- Old Time Strongman Training
- Logan’s Books
- [email protected]
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